Question

I’m asking the question after reading this article
http://stevehanov.ca/blog/index.php?id=95

Also isn’t it a penalty to use cgi instead of fastcgi ?

Update: why some people do pretend like in answer “that you get 20-30% performance improvement” ? Is it pure guess or is this number coming from solid benchmark ? I have looked at HipHop performance is more in the scale of 10 times.

Answer 1

I’ve done webdev in a few languages and frameworks, including python, php, and perl. I host them myself and my biggest sites get around 20k hits a day.

Any language and framework that has reasonable speed can be scaled up to take 20k hits a day just by throwing resources at it. Some take more resources than others. (Plone, Joomla. I’m looking at you).

My Witty sites (none in production yet) take a lot more (from memory around 5000% more) pounding (using seige) than for example my python sites. Ie. When I hit them as hard as I can with seige, the witty sites serve a lot more pages per second.

I know it’s not a true general test though.

Other speed advantages that witty gives you:

Multi threading

If you deploy with the built in websrever (behind ha-proxy for example) and have your app be multi-threaded .. it’ll load a lot less memory than say a perl or php app.

Generally with php and perl apps, you’ll have Apache fire up a process for each incoming connection, and each process loads the whole php interpreter, all the code and variables and objects and what not. With heavy frameworks like Joomla and WordPress (depending on the number of plugins), each process can get pretyy humungous on memory consumption.

With the Wt app, each session loads a WApplication instance (a C++ object) and it’s whole tree of widgets and stuff. But the memory the code uses stays the same, no matter how many connections.

The inbuilt Web2.0 ness

Generally with traditional apps, they’re still built around the old ‘http request comes in’ .. ‘we serve a page’ .. ‘done’ style of things. I know they are adding more and more AJAXy kind of thigns all the time.

With Wt, it defaults to using WebSockets where possible, to only update the part of the page that needs updating. It falls back to standard AJAX, then if that’s not supported http requests. With the AJAX and WebSockets enabled clients, the same WApplication C++ object is continually used .. so no speed is lost in setting up a new session and all that.

In response to the ‘C++ is too hard for webdev’

C++ does have a bit of a learning curve. In the mid nineties we did websites in Java j2ee. That was considered commercially viable back then, and was a super duper pain to develop in, but it did have a good advantage of encouraging good documentation and coding practices.

With scripting websites, it’s easy to take shortcuts and not realize they’re there. For example one 8 year old perl site I worked on had some code duplicated and nobody noticed. Each time it showed a list of products, it was running the same SQL query twice.

With a C++ site, I think it’d have less chance because, in the perl site, there wasn’t that much programming structure (like functions), it was just perl and embedded html. In C++ you’d likely have methods with names and end up with a name clash.

Types

One time, there was a method that took an int identifier, later on we changed it to a uuid string. The Python code was great, we didn’t think we needed to change it; it ran fine. However there was little line buried deep down that had a different effect when you passed it a string. Very hard to track down bug, corrupted the database. (Luckily only on dev and test machines).

C++ would have certainly complained a lot, and forced us to re-write the functions involved and not be lazy buggers.

With C++ and Java, the compiler errors and warns a lot of those sorts of mistakes for you.

I find unit testing is generally not as completely necessary with C++ apps (don’t shoot me), compared to scripting language apps. This is due to the language enforcing a lot of stuff that you’d normally put in a unit test for say a python app.

Summary

From my experience so far .. Wt does take longer to develop stuff in than existing frameworks .. mainly because the existing frameworks have a lot more out of the box stuff there. However it is easier to make extremely customized apps in Wt than say WordPress imho.